Will fedora have a mastodon now

it does not convince me the way twitter is going maybe after few months twitter will no longer present maybe bluesky takes over as it is the original product by the original guy of twitter my point is what you are talking about is like as mastodon is small we does not make our presence it is bad as a point you ever hear from the same way others will say we dont use or make software as linux is not sustainable or fedora is have a small userbase.
i think everyone is switching as i have shown you most distros are already in mastodon even rhel (redhat) so i think it is the right moment to be in fediverse

I would like to see Fedora in Mastodon as well, but since @bcotton had mentioned that Fedora wanted a sustainable plan (of which I somehow agree), maybe we can discuss about the existence of Fedora’s Mastodon Account again in the future. Many new Mastodon users don’t really understand the truly Fediverse yet and by being too rush will not bring any benefits for Fedora Community.

But probably I can suggest you to create a bot that will crosspost any Fedora tweets on Twitter to Mastodon, if you really want to see one. Just a suggestion.

You are not getting the point. We are not saying Mastodon is small or worthless, or twitter is better, or doing X or Y. We are saying that Mastodon doesn’t have the tools we require to manage the account, and we are looking for options, rushing into it “because is hot now” will end in an unmaintained account that will be lost in time and nobody gets the credentials, like it happened with other accounts like the LinkedIn one.

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Perhaps ask the folks at Raspberry Pi how they do it: https://raspberrypi.social/@Raspberry_Pi

(They’re also doing it right by having their own instance at their own domain.)

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can we ask some of them how do they do it and rhel is close to fedora so i am sure rhel will help

recently vivaldi open its own mastodon instance.

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I’ve been using Mastodon since Fosstodon was launched, but the fedoraproject instance would serve me and our Fedora community much better.

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sure

any update ??

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Oh, you were referring to a page rather than instance such as Fosstodon? There are some out there, such as this, but I am not sure how to sort this out in a libertarian world such as Mastodon.

i was looking for a official one from the fedora team

For my team, I wrote a playbook that deploy mastodon on Openshift. And one for Gotosocial. And also one for gotosocial outside of Openshift (for me).

However,

  • gotosocial do not support report, nor move for now. That’s fine for my personal instance (as I can report myself by speaking to myself, and I do not plan to move anytime soon), but not for a instance used by the communities we help. It might for a official/project/brand account.

  • the Mastodon deployment still have some technical issues I need to solve (pid issue, automatic VAPID key generation, full text search and elastic search sustainability), and is not “battle tested” (eg, rate limitation is maybe not working, the current ressources limit is set YOLO, I need to think about making sidekick sizing easier). I will be working on it (and testing with another smaller community), but that’s going to take a few months for something correct that could be suggested to Council, and that’s on top of the problems that @bcotton highlighted for sharing, and likely others.

And for the question of a paid hosting, that’s also unlikely to be doable in a short time frame due to complexity wrt suppliers with RH (as that’s RH who would deal with that). RH Legal has to vet the contract (and usually, they also ask for substantial changes), there is also various teams to review the infra (so privacy one, security one). And I remember in the past that the company had some hefty insurance requirements for the supplier, and surely others (things like requirements on how to pay, etc).

To give a idea of the timescale involved, my team is still working on getting the supplier for Fedora magazine approved since already a year, and the only reason why we can use it for now is because the contract was signed before the process changed.

Another example is the time it took to onboard NewVector for the matrix instance, I think it was a few months.

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does it is the official fedora mastodon why you have a older icon as a dp ??

There’s a significant difference between having a Fedora account on Mastodon on some server versus hosting a server with users. The latter, much like this site, requires maintenance and regular moderation, which is a lot of effort. That said, considering RHEL, AlmaLinux, and Rocky, among others, already have accounts somewhere, minimally having an account, say, on Fosstodon, even if it’s cross-posting to Twitter, seem like some low hanging, low overhead fruit that could definitely be beneficial for engagement on that platform. I don’t need to start dropping numbers, but I keep a personal list of prominent Fedora people on Mastodon and it’s grown significantly over the past week.

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That isn’t a verified account. That’s actually a very good reason that this should be done. I or anyone else can make a Fedora account on a server and start acting as though it were official right now. Not having a verified account is a potential trademark/community representation threat.

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yes this is a point and i really think a verification is required
maybe can be added or maybe you can open a feature request.

and i like the concept that you can contact with anyone like if you are in reddit and i am in twitter or facebook we can follow just like the email. whatever still mastodon is not perfect but now they are getting money and code help so i think it will be a better platform to live on.

I think that the simplest implementation we could do for a Fedora account is to understand how we would manage the credentials, at least while trying to figure out other details for how we would want to use it.

The most important login credentials seem to be held by people in the Fedora Council, so it seems like we would need someone at that level to make the account and manage it. Because there isn’t a way that I have found to share access to the account without sharing credentials, it means that most likely that account will be made and left alone until the account holder thinks to post or engage from that account. And then there’s the extra step of getting the account verified, though I would think that would be relatively simple if we make a ticket to whichever team manages getfedora[dot]org.

So first and foremost we need buy-in from the appropriate people at the highest level of the organization. Then we need them to be active on the account or otherwise set it up to cross-post from Twitter. If there isn’t a solution to sharing access or unless we decide that it’s ok to share credentials as long as it’s done by secure means, then that person who probably has a lot on their plate and potentially not as much interest in Mastodon would be the only way any content gets put out on the account. If the Marketing Team wanted to post on the Mastodon account, we’d essentially be pinging this person.

Other organizations may not have this problem because they may be set up differently or have people at the top level who do want to run a Mastodon account for their project. The Debian account cited above is unoffical. The Arch one didn’t have any posts. Yes, Rocky Linux has one but it seems like they’re not happy about how they’re authenticating right now. The closet potential solution I’ve found is what Ansible has implemented by using Bitwarden and that would require us being ok with sharing credentials which I don’t think is a place we’re at yet.

I could make a Fedora Project account right now if I wanted to, but it wouldn’t be the right way. If we want to do it, yes we can ask about it, but it also requires us to come to a consensus within the community rather than asking over and over again for something and ignoring the obstacles others have presented.

With all of that said, I can see this point as the one where we want to do the bare minimum of setting up an account that is verified by our home page just for the sake of planting our flag and making sure we’re not dealing with impersonators. I don’t think it will do that much to solve the problem because people will follow accounts that post and I don’t think folks will tag or reference an inactive account. Ideally we could follow this up with an actual presence, but if not this is the only reason that I see to justify making an account urgently. People are talking about Fedora anyway and they’ll continue to do so whether an account is there or not. The hashtag does a lot of heavy-lifting.


Here’s another idea. What if we made an unofficial Fedora community account that explicitly says it’s run by the Marketing Team? The Marketing Team would make the account and share the credentials just within the team via a process that we would have to outline. It would give the Fedora community a flagpole to rally around that gives people a lot of what they’re looking for in an official account while not saddling a busy Council member with more responsibility. And once we felt more comfortable with it, that community account could graduate into the official account.

It runs into similar issues as what has already been said in being the de facto Fedora account, does this work as a middle ground?

TL;DR: Credential mgmt is easy to screw AND it’s easy to do properly. I used to work at a company in that space.

When the time comes, I’m happy to recommend a process. I say “when the time comes” because the details will vary widely based on the solution we pick. I just don’t want cred mgmt to be the road block.

And if someone is really skeptical and they just can’t let go of this. I’m can do a 30 min review of the options.

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My attempt to summarize this long and constructive thread to take advantage of some progress in terms of shared understanding of Microblogging, Mastodon and the Fediverse.

TL; DR: No one has to do anything, and we’re seeing an explosion in open source adoption.


Some folks want an alternative to Twitter

Twitter is three services provided by the same company. It’s a directory server (an address book), a micro-blogging platform, and a direct message app. Individually, these services are unremarkable, the combination has become ubiquitous among desktop and mobile users.

Fedora is open

The Fedora community wants to be accessible and available to all. A presence on Twitter helps to maintain awareness, make announcements and serve as a point of contact for the public.

Fediverse is open

The purpose of the Fediverse is to enable interoperability between servers. Is ActivityPub the best specification? Probably not. But look what we have been able to do with HTTP.
It’s easy to get data in an out of Fediverse apps using transports that are ubiquitous (RSS, SMTP, HTTP, etc).

Twitter is closed

Twitter is a walled garden. Data is in the custody of Twitter and content authors have little discretion in how their data is handled. If Twitter decides to allow misinformation, hate speech and CASM, no one can stop them.

Only a handful of people in the world are rich enough to buy Twitter. One of them just did. The company has lost many employees, including everyone handling privacy and moderation. In a scramble to find alternatives, people are looking at the Fediverse, an open source collection of services built around another old web specification: ActivityPub

Services based on ActivityPub can replace Twitter

The combination of Mastodon, Matrix and Signal are superior alternatives to the Directory Service, Group Microblogging and Direct Messaging offered by Twitter.

  • Open Source apps are more consistent with Fedora’s values.
  • The Fediverse allows authors to maintain access and agency over their content.
  • The moderation capabilities are more flexible and easier to adjust.
  • The privacy afforded by Signal exceeds what Twitter is able to provide.

Mastodon is an ActivityPub client. Think of it like email.

Mastodon is more like email, you can host servers under your domain, or have someone host it for you. You can create an account on a public Mastodon server. You can obtain accounts on multiple servers and forward (or not).
Installing and hosting a Mastodon server is easy.
Moderating a Mastodon server is hard. Very hard.

A Mastodon server will tend to represent the values of its users

The server moderators determine how broadly to federate their content with others. Servers with lots of users may be slower and may allow content you don’t like. Servers that allow bad content risk getting de-federated by other servers. It’s a balance.


Play with https://gotosocial.fediverse.observer/ if you want to surf around to look at servers.
or peruse a light hearted pitch to join the Fediverse

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What solutions do you have in mind for dealing with credentials? I know the preference is to have keep the credentials with trusted folks in the community but share access to others. That’s what we currently do for the Twitter account via TweetDeck.

It doesn’t look like that options is available, so the most likely option in the short-term is using Bitwarden to share the password between folks. Next option would be some kind of encrypted channel which is not ideal but better than nothing.

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My preference is the automated approach, which could look like any of these scenarios:

  • Create a “bot” that can toot on behalf of the “Fedora team” account. Then provide the bot a list of authorized senders. The bot ignores everyone else.
  • Create CI job on Jenkins, gitlab, copr, etc with the credentials for the “Fedora Team” account. Designate a protected branch. When the right people push a commit to that protected branch, the CI job runs and toots using the team account

The other alternative is to get accounts with Authentic8 Silo and have the Silo admin delegate access to the Fedora Team account. This way each team member has their own creds to launch Silo, but only the group admin ever gets access to the team credentials.

(Disclosure: I used to work at Authentic8. I no longer have any financial interest in the company)

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