Hey Folks, I’m looking to dual-boot Fedora 43 with Windows 11 but I want to completely avoid GRUB. The main issue is that Windows updates consistently overwrite it, forcing a repair. I’m planning to use a separate EFI partition for Linux so Windows can’t touch it, and I’m considering either systemd-boot or rEFInd as the bootloader. I haven’t tried this setup before, so I need guidance on the exact steps: how to properly create and assign the second EFI partition during Fedora’s installation, how to install the alternative bootloader to that partition, and how to configure everything so both operating systems remain bootable without interference. Also i couldn’t find any guide or tutorial addressing this specific issue so if have the time and expertise i do believe make it would greatly contribute to our community. thanks for any help or response in advance
I am not sure what your configuration is, but with many years of dual booting windows & fedora I have never once seen windows mess up the grub boot.
It does happen if you do an installation of windows after fedora is already installed, but I have never had an issue with updates.
The simplest way to keep things totally separate is to use two separate drives, one for windows and the other for linux. Each drive would have its own EFI partition and grub on the fedora drive would be able to boot windows for you.
There are still issues with both rEFInd and systemd-boot, and using either of those as your boot loader will wipe out probably 90+% of us in being able to assist should you have issues in booting. Non-standard configs are out of the wheel-house for most users.
Grub is default for almost all fedora systems and has been stable for a long time. I think you are jumping into a bed of snakes if you move away from grub at present.
Also i couldn’t find any guide or tutorial addressing this specific issue so if have the time and expertise i do believe make it would greatly contribute to our community.
This has been discussed quite a few times. Here, here, here, here and here.
There are many here who dual boot Windows and Fedora (myself included), but I’ve never had an issue with Windows messing with grub.
Regardless, assuming the above links aren’t helpful enough, please do continue to ask questions until you have the desired result.
HTHAL.
I also recommend monitoring this topic as well since it expresses similar concerns and may yield useful information for you.
This is very difficult (almost impossible) when using a single drive since the bios can only support one ESP on a single drive
Not quite true, but many EFI boot managers cannot handle multiple ESPs. Offhand, I think maybe only GRUB might, since it can chain load from arbitrary partitions.
Disclaimer. The following are intended to provide info concerning relationships between TPM, bit locker and Microsoft ID:
Your Windows 11 Computer’s Hidden Spy: The Dark Truth About TPM Chips
The Only Safe Way to Use Windows 11 – Eliminate the Microsoft Account (MSA) Permanently
A Linux installation cannot co-exist on the same SSD as Windows 11 if bit locker is enabled. You may have to experiment to determine if Windows 11 will also destroy Linux installed on a separate SSD when bit locker is enabled.
Perhaps running Windows 11 in a VM could be a reasonable work-a-round.
Some UEFI can boot efi images from any vfat formatted partition, whether marked as ESP or not. I tested that with Tianocore as used by qemu.
Unfortunately my Pc has only one storage device slot
Why do you think that Windows wouldn’t also damage other bootloaders? Also, when you say it overwrites it, what do you mean?
I recommend you describe your bootloader issue in more detail, then we may be able to recommend something without having to guess what is happening on your machine.
For example by showing the UEFI boot menu. On linux you do that using efibootmgr.
I dual boot with windows 11 and Fedora 43 using Grub 2 and I have no issues.
I was on Windows 23 h2 prior to wiping recently and now I am on Windows 2024 LTSC so no Copilot spyware on my system.
If you need something from windows you can always explore winboat and others like it that allow you to run certain software inside the installation.
I signed up specifically to share what i’ve been thinking about with regard to linux booting after 15+ years of bootloader headaches: GRUB is too fragile, but there’s a thing that always works (never failed, while “regular grub” has failed me at least 100 times).
My solution: Ventoy + Super Grub2 Disk
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Create a multiboot USB with Ventoy
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Add the Super Grub2 Disk ISO to it
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This reliably boots anything—even with corrupted or missing bootloaders - you don’t even need a boot partition for any operating systems (I think this is true but will check)
Burn 2-3 copies and keep them handy. It’s ridiculous that a free USB tool is more dependable than a core system component, but here we are.
Dual-boot setup that actually works:
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Windows on its own drive, Linux on another
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Install each OS with the other drive physically disconnected
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Use your motherboard’s boot menu (F12/F8/etc.) to switch… OR:
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Leave the Ventoy USB plugged in permanently as your boot manager—it just works
I usually had each on different drives just to reduce the risk of anything going wrong. But if you are going to put both on one drive, just leave a Ventoy/SuperGrub2 usb in and just boot that way (keep copies/spares!).
Yes, it’s hacky. No, I shouldn’t need to do this. But after losing my mind literally too many times to GRUB errors, right in the middle of a work project coming due, this is the only approach I trust.
… If Super Grub2 Disk can detect and chainload any OS reliably, and seems to JUST WORK, why can’t we integrate similar logic/code as a built-in fallback bootloader? The technology clearly exists.
I keep going back to windows because I am worried some tiny glitch will happen. I have been trying some of the atomic linux core/desktops lately, I was all excited, came here and saw all the people saying Grub errors.. ugh! REALLY?? No backup methods for booting? I’m half loosing my mind just thinking about how mad I would be if that happened to me with an “atomic system”.
I’ve observed this problem sometimes. The simple solution is to install first Fedora and install after that Win11, grub will create the Windows entry in the grub boot menu. If you do it by installing secondly Fedora, it will give this result.
Also sure to set BIOS booting in Fedora and not WIndows Boot Manager.
Try it !