3rd Local London Meetup: 10th October, 6pm UK time, University College London

The Local London Meetup is back: We aim to organize a 3rd Local London Meetup. This is a follow up of the 2nd Local London Meetup.

Complementary casual discussions about dates, time, venues, topics (and the general type/content of the event) take place in our UK Matrix Channel, along to the exchange & decision making here.

So far, @ankursinha @hankuoffroad and me identified two dates that fit us three:

  • Thursday, 3rd October 2024
  • Thursday, 10th October 2024

These dates ain’t fixed, and we can consider other dates as well. But I would like to start already a poll to see if these dates are generally acceptable to all interested audience so that we can stop searching alternatives:


Supplement: The poll is closed but you can sign up to the event on 10th October until 7th October. See my post #26 below for all details.


“I will attend the 3rd Local London Meetup if it takes place at the following date(s)”:

  • Thursday, 3rd October 2024
  • Thursday, 10th October 2024
  • Some other date or time period, which I elaborate in a post below
  • Something else, which I elaborate in a post below
0 voters

As before, the event will take place in any case close to one of the central London terminals, and it will take place in the evening. The UCL is already a candidate as venue.

Further, we currently consider to start the event this time with 2 or 3 topics and related presentations and/or discussions, and then have chats and a beer (or something else) at the pub afterwards.

Feel free to suggest topics or offer presentations, but also feel free to suggest to stick with the casual pub chats, as the last time. Nothing is decided yet, the type of the event is open :slight_smile:

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Due to strengthening security and extreme risks in London, we need to monitor the situation. It is unsafe to travel to csntral London unless it is absolutely necessary.

Wow, I didn’t hear about that. But I wasn’t in UK for about two months now, and didn’t follow local news. Can you add some details of what the issue is?

Search ‘UK protest locations’. It is too sensitive to put here.

Thanks. I’ll do.

I’ve not seen anything around Euston/UCL at all. I expect it all to be over in the next few weeks anyway.

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Yeah, we still have much time until October. Hopefully, things will resolve constructively soon :+1:t3:

A potential topic/presentation I can offer would be a presentation about my current project which I aim to present at the next FOSDEM. This event could serve as a “beta freeze”, and beyond people involved in the project, it would make the London Meetup the first to get in touch with this. I aim to prepare the presentation after a meeting that I have in the beginning of September, so it surely will be ready by October. But several questions are still to be answered before mid-September, so there might be some changes to the below (so, beyond separating title and abstract :wink: ). I currently aim at the Software Bill of Materials devroom of FOSDEM, which seems closest in its aims/ends.

However, since the presentation aims at the respective FOSDEM format, this would be a 30 min presentation if we want to add this to the agenda. The topic needs a strong introduction.

The interim “title”/“anstract” at the moment is mostly a reminder, or an “abstract for myself”, to document some contents, relations and an order I want to implement. But it might already indicate what this would be about:


Information flows for knowledge creation and knowledge transfer when & where necessary (in short, problem solving): How the competition dynamics among people around Linux and Cryptography cause equilibria of collaboration and constructive competition that solves intuitively the problems in the anarchy of the Internet and Internet-dependent societies, while adaptively connecting the “sensors” (people), who experience a problem, with those who have the appropriate solution - or creating a competition that results in an appropriate solution.

How to integrate with and extend these massive capabilities for problem solving and how to create outreach and feedback loops, downstream to the most-non-tech organizations? How to make the demand of the latter again to the effective and efficient upstream of Linux & other developers to solve the problems throughout today’s socio-technical societies with the best possible socio-technical solutions?

An approach to create a new organizational architecture (with incentives for people and organizations to integrate with it) that aims to make the “downstream” to a “circle” of information flows - in both directions

… with an explanation why “people”, “outreach” and “understanding” are the keys to create the information flows that facilitate the security of confidentiality, integrity, availability, and the security of achieving and keeping the competitive advantage… in short, how to achieve the security of getting social, technical and mixed-socio-technical problems solved “effectively” “efficiently” “reliably” “on the long term” “with expected outcomes” and “without unexpected side effects”


You can already derive that my definition of terms like Linux or Open Source is more than just (open) code, but a complex socio-technical system “secure by design” for identifying and solving problems that achieves distributed (“distribution of powers” rather than “separation of powers”), adaptive, targeted and resilient competition, with “global sourcing” (done at the place/entity that does it best) while complemented with “socio-technical sourcing” (done by whatever means are best to solve the very problem: social or technical means, or a combination), with an emphasis on the level of people.

This elaboration will be related to my research at the Royal Holloway, but the presentation itself will not be academic as the academic research is something I consider myself more as a means rather than the end. Underlying theory/assumptions will be explained. The academic subproject is itself just one of two subprojects: the presentation will be the first overall presentation that aims to bring both subprojects together. The (sub)projects are derived from and influenced by my professional experiences [0] and from/by my previous research [1] [2] [3].

One possibility for a presentation.

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Related thread in devel mailing list: Fedora London Meetup, maybe together with SuSE, interest? Thoughts? - devel - Fedora mailing-lists

Hi Chris,

I have also given presentations in this direction in the past. The Linux Distro room at FOSDEM 2022 gave me the opportunity to talk about “Collaboration instead of Competition” [0] speaking about the Linux Distributions Working Group Collaboration at the Open Mainframe Project [1]. I also found interesting research material for that.

This year, I gave a German update at Grazer Linuxtage [2] regarding this topic involving the business/customer perspective because I was asked what you should use now and how the decisions should be made with a benefit also for the community [3]. openQA and other things are also added there.

I hope that it can help you.

[0] Collaboration instead of Competition - TIB AV-Portal
[1] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/383008114_Collaboration_Instead_Of_Competition
[2] Erfolgreiche Zusammenarbeit von Linux-Distributionen :: Grazer Linuxtage 2024 :: pretalx
[3] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/383012808_Erfolgreiche_Zusammenarbeit_von_Linux-Distributionen

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Added #uk-sig

4 posts were split to a new topic: Compliance questions about meetups

Cross-community agenda and collaboration is a good approach. We can all learn from that. Examples in a more practical level are Open Build Service and openQA.

I just thought it would be better for me to take a brief hiatus from what I was used to and come back with fresh energy in 2025.

I spend an hour on every week with Ubuntu technical authors/engineers on video call, which gives me a new perspective and energy. Mind-blowing experience, really.

A hiatus also means I have more time with ‘learning’ foundational knowledge than contributing and interacting with other fellow contributors. I hope you understand my position.

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@imcinerney you made the difference :classic_smiley:

We have fixed the date to the 10th October - we aim to meet at 6 pm, but keep the door open till 6:30 pm so that people can smoothly arrive. If discussions have already risen during that period, we can skip the talk. Otherwise, if people want, we can do one: two topics are in consideration - we write something about it soon: in any case, it would be something that can facilitate discussions and that everyone can say something about, and at the best, something that can bring different fields together and allow them to exchange perspectives. Feel free to add any thoughts or preferences here in advance. In any case, the talk it to make people talk, its a means, not the end of the event :classic_smiley:

Additionally to people from Fedora, this is to become a cross-community event that aims to informally bring people from different communities together without imposing a topic or so, in order to informally exchange, let innovation & thoughts flow, and of course have fun together :slight_smile:

Patrick Fitzgerald will be with us, he is member of the board of openSuSE, and he might bring also a couple of people to the event. We’re happy to have them with us :slight_smile:

The venue will be the the University College London (UCL): we expect that we will get a venue for up to about 20 people (so far we expect something between 5 and 15). We expect that we can let you know about the exact venue in UCL (and its capacity) soon and keep you updated (thanks @ankursinha for organizing the venue at UCL!).

We aim to leave the poll and the possibility to sign up open until a few days before the event (I will add a specific date later): people can sign up by poll here (see above), or feel free to let Patrick or me ( py0xc3 -at- fedoraproject.org ) know by email (or other means) if you have no FAS account. Also, feel free to join our Matrix channel: #region-uk:fedoraproject.org (direct link of Fedora Chat)

Additionally, our friends from openSuSE will sponsor some snacks & drinks (thanks to Patrick & the Geeko Foundation!).

Also, thanks @skriesch for establishing the connection between us and Patrick - you have been a facilitator for this event :classic_smiley:

Added uk-sig

Thank you for recognizing me as a facilitator. Sorry that I can not participate based on the fact that I am located in Germany, But “Have a lot of fun!”. :slight_smile:

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You might want to consider insights from contributor survey, which is a great source of information to understand common challenges in any community projects.

We have a room provisionally booked and it should be confirmed this week. (It’s the same room as we were in last time at the IOE)

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The room has been booked/confirmed folks. Please send me your details if you’re coming so I can pass them on to UCL security:

  • your name (as on some ID that you’ll carry in case they want to check)
  • your affiliation
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The Local London Meetup of Fedora & openSuSE/Geeko will take place on 10th October 2024 at 6pm. It will be at the IOE building (UCL Faculty of Education and Society, 20 Bedford Way, London WC1H 0AL) in room 639.

The meeting will be an informal gathering aimed at learning what issues/problems are common to different FOSS communities and to try to come up with tasks/projects/ideas that we can work together on to benefit everyone.

The agenda for the meeting includes a talk by Chris (py0xc3) [1] that will begin around 6:30 PM followed by open discussion:

“About information flows & feedback loops: Why collaboration is competition in Open Source, and how its contributors embed Linux in modern societies but not yet integrate with them (45 min)”

Please let Ankur Sinha know if you’re coming before the 7th of October [2]. We need to provide a list to UCL security to allow all attendees into the building. You will need to send him your full name (as it appears on an ID you’ll carry in case UCL security want to check) and your affiliation. Those who have already signed up in the poll above are already registered.

[1] LinkedIn profile

[2] e-mail to: ankursinha@fedoraproject.org or drop a PM on Fedora Discussion: Profile - ankursinha - Fedora Discussion

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